s543
in service - 2 years
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Post by s543 on Jul 7, 2015 14:16:16 GMT 1
Looking at your list - one understand what an effort the introduction and application of design changes is. Hopefully this precludes Boeing's problems with the "troubled teens" and we will not observe similarities with A350  |
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sciing
in service - 1 year
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Post by sciing on Jul 7, 2015 16:06:17 GMT 1
Looking at your list - one understand what an effort the introduction and application of design changes is. Hopefully this precludes Boeing's problems with the "troubled teens" and we will not observe similarities with A350 I think we have to be careful with what we call rework. I guess some part is traveled work or work which is not yet included into the FAL or pre FAL stations. For example the cabin outfit should be done during S30, but this seems to be not the case, yet. Maybe there need to be some stuff done which should be later transferred to pre-FAL. |
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Post by stealthmanbob on Jul 7, 2015 16:17:05 GMT 1
Looking at your list - one understand what an effort the introduction and application of design changes is. Hopefully this precludes Boeing's problems with the "troubled teens" and we will not observe similarities with A350 I think we have to be careful with what we call rework. I guess some part is traveled work or work which is not yet included into the FAL or pre FAL stations. For example the cabin outfit should be done during S30, but this seems to be not the case, yet. Maybe there need to be some stuff done which should be later transferred to pre-FAL. Q. Do they put any of the large interior items (eg the massive first class seats) in side the frame before / during body join to save taking them apart to get Them thru the doors ? |
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s543
in service - 2 years
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Post by s543 on Jul 7, 2015 16:36:52 GMT 1
sciing - we discussed before some months what rework is - and was agreed that it is work done to implement changes introduced during the time.
It might be something similar to change of the wings and doors we observe with A380 but prior delivery to save problems later etc. So I do believe there are two parts:
-disassemble something which is already completed and make it different in the process
-some parts were not yet assembled onto the frame but are changed during completion i.e. more labor is needed and similar...
So if My perception (and definition discussed few month back) is correct - we will not see rework as the production matures (or much smaller amount of it). The production os long process - some parts were made years back and during the time knowledge and understanding progressed i.e. changes are introduced.
But of course as the maturity of any product progresses the later product SHOULD be always better, and it should not be other way.
We can not in good sense compare A330 MSN~20 with the one made last month - it is after over 22 years very different plane.
What I wanted to say is that AB is trying HARD to make the "teen" A350 as good as current knowledge and experience allows.
We see now HUGE "rework" done by BO 3 years later just to get rid of the "troubled teen" airplanes and they are the same MSNs as the A350s in the rework process. BO took different attitude they hurriedly made the planes, but than the customers rejected to take them i.e. next series came and those were sitting on the tarmac for VERY LONG time. If you look at the discussion there - there were even predictions they will go for scrape !
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sciing
in service - 1 year
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Post by sciing on Jul 7, 2015 21:13:23 GMT 1
Q. Do they put any of the large interior items (eg the massive first class seats) in side the frame before / during body join to save taking them apart to get Them thru the doors ? I do not know if 1st class seats but at least this is the aim of station S59, before body join acc. to the Airbus FAL presentation video. |
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XWB
in service - 11 years
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Post by XWB on Jul 7, 2015 21:25:34 GMT 1
To clarify:
- Big cabin monuments (like crew rest area's) are installed in S59.
- Economy seats are currently installed in S20, after assembly/rework/paint.
- Economy seats will eventually be installed during final assembly in S30 once rework is not required anymore.
- Business and First class seats - just like the engines - will always be installed in S20.
The most expensive items (engines, first class etc) will be installed at the very last moment to keep stock costs down.
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s543
in service - 2 years
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Post by s543 on Jul 7, 2015 21:56:45 GMT 1
To clarify: - Big cabin monuments (like crew rest area's) are installed in S59. - Economy seats are currently installed in S20, after assembly/rework/paint. - Economy seats will eventually be installed during final assembly in S30 once rework is not required anymore. - Business and First class seats - just like the engines - will always be installed in S20. The most expensive items (engines, first class etc) will be installed at the very last moment to keep stock costs down. Thanks XWB for nice explanation ! One question not yet pertained to A350 but to some A330 and others. We know that major upgrade of the cabin i.e. complete exchange - was done (after years of operation) - How they get those large items inside ? There was even rebuilt of 2-4-2 seating to 3-3-3 (for instance TRANSAT A332). Or complete exchange of all seats on Brussels A333 - it was done in MALTA and the whole process took 2 weeks ? How is that possible ? Will this be possible on A350 after 2025 ? |
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XWB
in service - 11 years
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Post by XWB on Jul 7, 2015 21:59:04 GMT 1
By splitting the large monuments into smaller pieces.
Sure, it just requires more work.
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XWB
in service - 11 years
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Post by XWB on Jul 9, 2015 14:49:20 GMT 1
MSN26 was less than 30 days in S30. Final assembly lead time is decreasing significantly.
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philidor
in service - 6 years
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Post by philidor on Jul 9, 2015 16:30:08 GMT 1
MSN26 was less than 30 days in S30. Final assembly lead time is decreasing significantly. I don't remember how long previous MSNs stayed in S30. Was it much longer ? Anyhow, shorter lead times is great news. |
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