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Post by pedernal74 on Oct 17, 2014 10:43:16 GMT 1
How can I understand that? If a customer just wants ETOPS 180, will he get a plane with less reliable components? Different specifications? Or does every single plane have to go through a certification process of its own that becomes more extensive (and expensive) with higher ETOPS rating? Aside from local government restrictions, why do ETOPS ratings differ? I would imagine that it has something to do with maintenance procedures etc. The components should be the same.
"ETOPS approval is a two-step process. First, the airframe and engine combination must satisfy the basic ETOPS requirements during its type certification. This is called ETOPS type approval. Such tests may include shutting down an engine and flying the remaining engine during the complete diversion time. Often such tests are performed in the middle of the ocean. It must be demonstrated that, during the diversion flight, the flight crew is not unduly burdened by extra workload due to the lost engine and that the probability of the remaining engine failing is extremely remote. For example, if an aircraft is rated for ETOPS-180, it means that it should be able to fly with full load and just one engine for 3 hours. Second, an operator who conducts ETOPS flights must satisfy their own country's aviation regulators about their ability to conduct ETOPS flights. This is called ETOPS operational certification and involves compliance with additional special engineering and flight crew procedures in addition to the normal engineering and flight procedures. Pilots and engineering staff must be qualified and trained for ETOPS. An airline with extensive experience operating long distance flights may be awarded ETOPS operational approval immediately, others may need to demonstrate ability through a series of ETOPS proving flights. Regulators closely watch the ETOPS performance of both type certificate holders and their affiliated airlines. Any technical incidents during an ETOPS flight must be recorded. From the data collected, the reliability of the particular airframe-engine combination is measured and statistics published. The figures must be within limits of type certifications. Of course, the figures required for ETOPS-180 will always be more stringent than ETOPS-120. Unsatisfactory figures would lead to a downgrade, or worse, suspension of ETOPS capabilities either for the type certificate holder or the airline." |
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henge
Final Assembly Line stage 2
Posts: 346
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Post by henge on Oct 17, 2014 10:58:54 GMT 1
Thanks for the explanations, guys! So this would mean that the aircraft itself is officially certified for ETOPS 370, and if individual airlines are able/allowed to operate it like that or only on a downgraded level, say ETOPS 300, is a matter between the airline and its national oversight agency. Right? The reason for my confusion is the passage in the flightglobal article, that Baroque linked to: To me this sounds as if the aircraft as delivered by airbus to the customer would be different, depending on what ETOPS rating they wish/have. |
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Baroque
in service - 2 years
Posts: 3,991
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Post by Baroque on Oct 17, 2014 15:02:44 GMT 1
To me this sounds as if the aircraft as delivered by airbus to the customer would be different, depending on what ETOPS rating they wish/have. I think I read somewhere that the higher the ETOPS rating, there's more hardware you have to add to the aircraft like inerting systems that last longer. If you don't require that level of ETOPS, there's not point in paying for those and it only adds to weight. Plus, I also believe that approved aircraft can be upgraded to different levels through appropriate hardware and maintenance protocol changes. This is all in addition to the policies of the local regulatory bodies as mentioned earlier. |
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henge
Final Assembly Line stage 2
Posts: 346
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Post by henge on Oct 18, 2014 4:42:49 GMT 1
Ah, I see! That makes sense. So the individual aircraft are in fact delivered in different configurations. Thanks for clearing that up!  |
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s543
in service - 2 years
Posts: 3,959 
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Post by s543 on Oct 18, 2014 9:35:20 GMT 1
Are you sure the aircraft are different ?
I thought that above the plane certification it is a question of Airline protocols and certification, Country rules etc.
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Baroque
in service - 2 years
Posts: 3,991
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Post by Baroque on Oct 18, 2014 15:11:06 GMT 1
Are you sure the aircraft are different ? I thought that above the plane certification it is a question of Airline protocols and certification, Country rules etc. Not entirely different. Just to make stuff last longer. I can't remember the exact source I read, but here's a very good article describing exactly what I was talking about. Worth a read. www.adsopp.com/assets/files/Resources-Articles/Aviation%20Week%20ETOPS%203.12.pdf |
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s543
in service - 2 years
Posts: 3,959
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Post by s543 on Oct 19, 2014 13:30:58 GMT 1
Thank you Baroque.
The article is interesting and above those halon extinguisher it says a little.
Basically probably stricter maintenance on engines but latter in the article there is said.... if the maintenance is done according to manufacturers recommendation it should be OK, so really it looks like more paperwork not much real work ?
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Post by nicolele on Nov 6, 2014 14:04:20 GMT 1
FAA certification is expected before the end of the month. Have we any update for FAA certification? |
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XWB
in service - 11 years
Posts: 16,115
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Post by XWB on Nov 6, 2014 14:05:11 GMT 1
No, it's pretty quiet on the other side of the pond.
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LM72C
in Body Join
University student
Posts: 163
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Post by LM72C on Nov 6, 2014 14:09:05 GMT 1
No, it's pretty quiet on the other side of the pond. Something wrong? |
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